Podcast - Florida’s Equine Landscape

Nathan Adams: Welcome to Holland & Knight's Florida Capital Conversations podcast series. Today, our subject is Florida's equine landscape, and our guests are Kayla Pragid and Tori Deal. Kayla is a trial and litigation partner in Holland & Knight's West Palm Beach office. She's the founder and chair of Holland & Knight's Equine Industry Team. Tori Deal is a public affairs advisor in Holland & Knight's Tallahassee office. She assists clients with equestrian lobbying and government consulting. My name is Nathan Adams. My co-host is Mia McKown. We are so pleased that you have joined us today to consider another interesting issue bearing on state government affecting Florida business and communities. There's none better than Kayla and Tori to kick off our discussion of Florida's equine landscape. Let me begin by asking you both to tell us a little more about yourselves. 

Kayla Pragid: Hi everybody. I'm Kayla Pragid, and as Nate just gave of me in my introduction, I'm in our West Palm Beach office and I was actually born and raised in Palm Beach County, Florida, which is here, where the Winter Equestrian Festival is held in Wellington every year. And being out in the western communities in Palm Beach County really gave me an immense appreciation for the horse community and just how passionate horse owners and riders and operators are, and what really got me interested in equine law. 

Tori Deal: Thanks, Nate. So my name is Tori Deal. As Nate's already touched on, I'm a public affairs advisor here in the Tallahassee office. I work in our Public Policy & Regulation Group. Mostly, I'm focusing on client support and legislative and public policy, which drew me to the equine practice here at the firm. Just leveraging the knowledge I have from being an equestrian myself and seeing, you know, what initiatives we can accomplish to really help that industry out. Yeah. And so I'm happy to be here. 

Mia McKown: It's great to have y'all both here. This is Mia. It's nice to meet you, Kayla. Just one thing I find so unique about Holland & Knight is that we have practices for all different aspects that you don't even know that the law will touch on. I know you talked about the West Palm Beach and how the horses are such a big deal in the Wellington area, but what made you think that we need to start an equine team here at Holland & Knight? Because I think that's probably one of our most unique practices that I've heard of at our firm. 

Kayla Pragid: You know, it started very organically. So my practice has for about a decade been fraud and unfair and deceptive trade practices. And in that space, I started getting quite a few equine fraud matters come across my desk and started assisting folks with those. And in doing that work, I really realized what an incredible bench of lawyers we have here at Holland & Knight across a lot of different offices. And so I started putting folks together, and we started having meetings very informally, and then just realized there really was a need in the industry for a firm that has offices in multiple states, especially the equestrian hotspots like California, Florida, Virginia, Massachusetts, Pennsylvania, and these are all states in which we had equine lawyers. And so I was really inspired to put us all together into a group. And many of our lawyers actively compete in showjumping, rodeo, polo, and so not only did we have folks that were actively practicing equine law, but also folks that are really true equestrians, and it really inspired me to create the group. And we now have about 30 lawyers and members across over a dozen offices at the firm. 

Mia McKown: That's just really interesting. And I had no idea that we had so many people that were actually equestrians in the firm. So you learn something new every day. That's why I love these podcasts. 

Nathan Adams: Tori, how about you? What inspired you to become an equestrian lobbyist and consultant? 

Tori Deal: Yeah, sure. Thanks for the question. So I ride here at a local farm in Tallahassee and I have for years now. I also grew up in a small town in Wakulla County, so I'm just no stranger to being outdoors and all that comes with that. When you know, you're out at the farm, it's peaceful. You're enjoying all that Florida has to offer. You have beautiful green spaces with a horse. Crunchy, as most of you know, would be the horse that I've been riding. And for some reason, this horse enjoys my company and I enjoy being out there. It's disconnecting, and there's really nothing better than when you're in the saddle. So when Kayla started this group and approached me to join, for me, it was I'm going to turn a passion into a purpose because it mattered. So it's seeing how important the industry is to those that I am with every weekend, and also to those that may not understand they have a voice in this process, you know, and I'm trying to bridge that gap between the equine industry and the decision makers so that we can keep the industry thriving. And I also think it's really realizing this, it's the best way to ensure our generations can experience the same enjoyment, connection that I have. And so, you know, you step up, you're leveraging your knowledge of the equine matters and governmental processes. And that helps us guide clients, you know, with navigating our legislative landscapes. And then we're able to promote issues like equine welfare, land use for certain equestrian activities. And then there's also funding that is available for equestrian programs. I think by leveraging that knowledge and Kayla starting this group, we're able to explain to industry, you know, these options are here, you know, and we can sustain and grow this equestrian industry. And I think,  overall, my love for being an equestrian really, you know, it hit home with me. And so I've really enjoyed being in this group and lobbying for the cause. 

Mia McKown: Kayla, kind of following up on some things that you said and also with Tori. I know we've got this practice here and you mentioned what first got your attention, you noticed some fraud in the industry. You know, there was something fraud going on. I never would have thought that in the equine industry. What kind of resources does the firm have for, you know, equine legal and consulting? You know, you see horses, you see the competitiveness, the races. But you don't often think about, you know, legal and consulting. So what kind of resources do we have that we make available to this unique industry? 

Kayla Pragid: Thanks, Mia, for the question. It was interesting when we first started because I think we started with a much more narrow mindset than where we ended. And so we as a group provide, I think what we'll call traditional equine services that the everyday person would understand. For example, assistance with purchasing and selling horses, leasing horses, some traditional equine activities. We also do quite a few what I'll call non-traditional equine activities, such as assisting non-equine-related clients with activities that touch on the equine industry. As an example would be a hotel. You know, we represent some hotel chains, and those hotel chains may offer guests trail riding as an activity for the hotel. There comes some potential liability with that. So assisting, you know, what we like to call equine adjacent clients, or clients that touch on the equine industry, protect themselves against potential litigation, take advantage of different statutory protections that the state of Florida has for them. Well, that'll be kind of bucket number two. 

And then we also help with, we have folks in our group that help buy and sell equine facilities, equine-related farms, agricultural issues that come with those. We also have some folks that assist clients with stallion shares. So oftentimes you'll have a stallion that's very valuable with respect to its breeding rights, but perhaps it's too expensive for one client or owner to pay for. And so we'll help syndicate the shares and go through that process. 

We also have a really great practice, a regulatory practice with respect to anti-doping and gaming. And so we actually have a former Florida state regulator who works in our Miami office who's been really instrumental in helping gaming clients with horse racing, horse betting online and also regulatory issues that come up with anti-doping of horses. 

And then, of course, my practice, which is litigation. So any type of equine litigation, whether that be fraud or, you know, a horse is injured in transport or a lease is broken and there needs to be some enforcement from a litigation perspective. Things like that. 

Nathan Adams: Tori, so tell us a little bit more about the ways the equine community contributes to the state's economy. We've already heard some aspects of that. But, you know, there may be folks listening who are not active in the equine industry and maybe don't have a sense for really what the implications of it are. 

Tori Deal: Sure. Now, this is actually my favorite question because it shows how important the industry is to our state. So Florida, it actually houses nearly almost every breed of horse. And so as a result of that, the equine industry supports, as Kayla's already mentioned, a wide variety of activities. So that's breeding, training, racing, polo, rodeo, competitive show events like dressage, cross country, showjumping, trail riding, the list goes on with that. So the equine industry contributed $177 billion to the U.S. economy, with an economic impact of $12.78 billion just in Florida, which fun fact is equated to more than all collegiate sports in the state. So with a population of more 332,000 horses, Florida is ranking third in the number of equines in the United States, behind Texas, California, and it's a force to be reckoned with. And I'm here for it. I think it's impressive that economic impact that it has. 

Mia McKown: Well, I'm here for it too. I think that's awesome, Tori. I'm very intrigued by this topic. Kayla, with all the activity that's going on, it seems like, not only just in Florida but across the nation, what challenges do you see the industry facing?

Kayla Pragid: One of the biggest challenges, I think, in the industry is that we as a nation have become more litigious. And so the industry has often, I think, historically proceeded with a trusting type of handshake deal mindset. And I think that's been because equestrians are tried and true good people that are out there for the betterment of the horses. And I think they've always put a lot of faith in other folks in the industry. But given how litigious the United States has become, I think folks, especially some clients, you know, we've been assisting in the last couple of years, have really understood the benefit of having written contracts and agreements and protections and liability waivers and, you know, waivers they have folks sign that come on their premises and things like that. So I think that's one challenge I've seen in the industry is the jump from this very trusting, we don't need agreements, to this we should have an agreement, but I don't want you to be offended that I want an agreement because I still trust you. But I want these protections for both of us. And I think that mindset jump has been somewhat of a challenge. 

I've also seen as kind of a second challenge, an uptick in anti-doping and enforcement actions in horse racing. So the Biden Administration created some new regulations. And within those, there's been a lot of talk in the industry about them and challenges facing horse racing as a result of some of those laws. And so those are, I guess, the two biggest issues I've seen come up in the last couple of years with our clients. 

Mia McKown: It's sad, but it's the way of the world. I saw that in the citrus industry as well — and I think that's a lot in the agriculture community — where they did things with gentlemen's agreements and things of that nature. And so, I guess, it's great for lawyers, but it is a new way of doing business. And sometimes the folks are a little slow to want to do that because, like you said, they don't want to offend people by presenting them with a contract. So, but they do need to do that, obviously, to protect themselves. And we have people like you that can help them do it. That's great. 

What is FDACS? What does that stand for? Tori. 

Tori Deal: So FDACS stands for the Florida Department of Agriculture and Consumer Services.

Mia McKown: FDACS is actually a really unique state agency. They not only deal with consumer services, but I know, Tori, with the industry that's near and dear to our hearts, is agriculture. And so is that where the equine industry are? Do they have responsibility over that? 

Tori Deal: That is correct. They do have a portion of the equine industry. They mostly are overseeing, you know, their operations and ensuring, you know, the water quality and environmental standards are met through what they call BMPs. And just for those who may not know what that is, that is a best management practice. And it's exactly what that means, right? Are we having the best management practices of your facilities or your agricultural operation that meets environmental standards? And so the department will come up with these standards through a public comment period so that when they set these, everybody's on the same page. And so that's, you know, what that program is, and it is housed within the Florida Department of Agriculture and Consumer Services. 

Nate Adams: Tori, you sit on the Florida Department of Agriculture and Consumer Services Equine Best Management Practices Committee. Well, that's a mouthful. How does that impact Florida's rules, regulations relating to the industry, and how can that help shape the landscape for clients in the future? 

Tori Deal: Yeah, sure. Well, let me start by saying that FDACS has been wonderful in their collaborative efforts with the equine industry. I'd have to give a shoutout to Commissioner Simpson and his team within the Office of Agricultural Water Policy. They have a full transparency approach right now to updating a series of rulemaking. There are multiple in the "ag" atmosphere that they're updating manuals and rulemaking that will follow in a pretty quick pace. And so by sitting on these committees, it really does allow us to position our clients maybe in this atmosphere, so that these rules and regulations impact them in the best way possible when, you know, they come to be finalized.

So right now, the departments, as I've said, they're tasked with updating a series of manuals and the rulemaking that's going to follow. And most recently, we were working together on the equine BMP manual and the rulemaking that's going to go alongside that here shortly. I think for us it allows our clients to have a voice at the table. We're ensuring that these rulemaking changes and manual updates are, you know, as I've said, turning out favorable for their operations. And it's reflecting the realities of what they need, you know, those that are most affected. And I think it's a very proactive method that the department is using by bringing us all to the table prior to publishing these manuals and rulemaking. It's also allowing us to work with the department for our clients related to available resources. Whether you have a large or small operation, maybe that's cost sharing with FDACS to something you need to do that's a better environmental standard. Or maybe that's just understanding what is a BMP? As most of us know, that's basically a best management practice that's designed to improve water quality while maintaining their agricultural production. So I think overall the department is wanting to help. And I believe having this collaborative relationship is going to be the key to success for our clients and everyone included that may want to get involved. And so right now, if for what it's worth, it's on their website. And I think just having a seat at the table, you know, as I've said, allows us to direct those initiatives in a favorable way. 

Mia McKown: Kayla, kind of following up a little bit on what Tori's talking about. Some of the new rulemaking that's going on at FDACS. Are there any new rules or laws that our group here at Holland & Knight has dealt with? Let's say, for example, that touch upon the equine liability statute and the administrative code for buying and selling horses. 

Kayla Pragid: There are. So I wouldn't say the laws are new, but I would say that they've been used more in the recent past than we've seen historically. And so the first one is Florida's equine liability statute, and that statute really has some incredible protections for what they call equine sponsors, which are folks that touch on the equine industry. And leveraging that statute to protect you as a client or as a barn owner or an equine operator or sponsor, whether you own a racetrack or you're just having folks do trail rides on your property, has been really critical for us. Just education across the industry and of our clients. 

And then the second one that you mentioned is what we loosely refer to as the equine admin regulations, which, of course, they have a much more formal long name than that, but those really regulate the day to day. So, you know, what kind of things do you put in a written bill of sale? And, as I mentioned earlier, there's been some stressors in the industry with respect to converting from oral agreements to written ones, and the equine administrative regulations clearly lay out what needs to be in these written agreements. And so just ensuring if you are a horse owner or a barn owner or run an equine facility, that you're aware that these laws exist and that you do need to be compliant with the administrative regulations has been really great. And we've done some seminars for folks, we've given them educational materials and done some educational workshops on these different rules and regulations. 

And then outside of Florida, kind of nationwide, I touched upon this a little earlier, but Congress in 2020 enacted the Horse Integrity and Safety Act, which is commonly known as HISA. And that was really kind of the first horse racing, racetrack safety regulations and anti-doping laws that were out there. And although the law was enacted in 2020, the safety regulations and anti-doping rules took effect in 2022 and 2023, so very recently. We've really been starting to see those laws take effect in the racing industry. And there has been some pushback. So the racing folks, you know, I think there's two schools of thought. One is we don't need to be overregulated, and so there's been some pushback. And I think the other half of the industry recognizes that regulations are necessary to ensure that the animals are treated fairly because, for example, we saw when that movie Blackfish came out about the controversy over captive orca whales at SeaWorld, there was a huge boycott of the industry, and it really hurt the industry. And so I think kind of the second school of thought is let's regulate this and ensure the animals are treated appropriately so that we ensure the continued success of horse racing because people have faith in the industry that they're going to protect the horses. And so I think those are kind of the two big issues from a legal perspective that we've been seeing pretty frequently. 

Nathan Adams: Great. Well Tori, I suppose the future of Florida equestrian law is being created today. How do you see advocacy work shaping up in the near future? 

Tori Deal: Well, I think we are already seeing the trends and efforts for the industry being advocated for. I think myself and others in this space will continue to see advocacy for land preservation, environmental protection standards due to Florida's rapid development and growth, which we all know. I think you'll continue to see us pushing for also preservation of "ag" lands and conservation easements that, you know, both DEP and FDACS will be pushing for, which will protect certain areas for years to come. You'll also see that we're already seeing support for small farms and equine businesses. Maybe it's advocating for tax incentives, grants, funding that's currently available. Maybe funding that should be available that's not yet, such as, I've seen a lot of I would say training with equestrian therapy programs, some of which got funding last session. Maybe it's for new equestrian eventing facilities through public-private partnerships, which we have, you know, already helped certain clients in the bidding process of these type of situations. I think you're also going to see relief from burdensome regulations. And I think that's what we want to see, making it easier for the industry to be successful. And then lastly, I think what everyone is seeing right now is public awareness. Every celebrity you can think of — Snoop, Martha, Beyonce — the whole world has gone country. And I think you're even seeing political staffers campaigning on horseback most recently in the political atmosphere. So I think our advocacy efforts are just going to aim to build stronger relationships between the equine industry and then also the broader community. Florida community, really. It's also just us letting our leaders know and educating the public on the contributions to the state's economy and our environment and how it bolsters our culture of our state while we engage local communities, foster more support and come up with, you know, equestrian friendly policies. But at the same time, we're also going to have to balance a growing Florida. And so I think that's what you're going to see, is consultants such as myself pushing for conservation easements and being an ear. How can we help? Who can we get you in front of? You know, let's help this industry be here for years to come. 

Mia McKown: Kayla and Tori, I really appreciate you all joining us today. It was very informative, and I learned an awful lot about the equine industry. And just it's a fascinating industry and there's so many different aspects of it, from whether it's hotels or buying and selling. And we're here and have all the resources to help people who touch on that industry. And thank you so much for sharing your expertise and your knowledge with Nate and I today and our listeners. 

Nathan Adams: Yep. And I want to thank also my co-host Mia McKown for joining us today and asking some great questions. Most of all, I want to thank each of you for joining us today. Please plan to join us for our next Florida Capital Conversations podcast. Have a great day.